Starting large Open Source OS! Large Project! Help!

[os64dev]

No, not again... We do not want new users to leave, no?...

if they have lame or stupid behaviour. yes we do..

[Combuster]

Everybody makes mistakes. I hope he learnt from this one, but you shouldn't deduce from a single mistake that someone is a stupid person.

Now IMHO how stupid the thread creator might have been, public humiliation is *not* the right way. (I seriously doubt he is anyway).

[gaf]

I hate to burst your bubble chuckd1356, But these "Web2.0" OS's are completely unrealistic

Somebody should tell the guys working on EyeOS that they're just wasting their time

After all of this work you would then need to support the technologies used by these "WebOS's", So a complete HTML renderer.. Javascript... Flash? Java?

This is where the "Operating System Interface" comes into play: Using a technology similiar to VNC the OSI allows clients to connect to their web OS without having to implement anything but the most basic functionality

What is the point in storing my Operating System on some other Harddrive somewhere when i have a perfectly good one right here?

- Using a remote server allows you to access your files from any computer that connects to the internet
- An administrator will take care of system configuration, updates and the installation of additional programmes
- Exchange of files between users of the same provider can be done over a local network and thus won't be limited by bandwidth
- The OS provider might install a web cache to speed-up download times for its clients

regards,
gaf

[Tyler]

- Using a remote server allows you to access your files from any computer that connects to the internet
- An administrator will take care of system configuration, updates and the installation of additional programmes
- Exchange of files between users of the same provider can be done over a local network and thus won't be limited by bandwidth
- The OS provider might install a web cache to speed-up download times for its clients

Wow... read entire posts much? Or do you just like to skim and misinterpret?

I clearly stated in my post that i was all for being able to access my files from anywhere, and i am a supporter of Online Storage. My comment alluded to the idea that the Operating System should be stored locally where it runs fast. Now that you mention it though most files don't need to be remote so i see no use for these complete Web Desktops and remote storage, when a complimentary system (Like Windows Live, only less sucky) is far more appropriate. Also, with the current number of permentally online system's increasing, access from anywhere would be far more appropriately run from a home computer in order to reduce the need to have the same data repeated locally and on a remote store.

Updates can easily be automated and Installations be simplified on current systems. I really don't see what you are saying this one, other than that my data s freely accessible to a remote administrator, i have less control over my system and that just so i don't have to click some "Next" buttons i have to run my software hundreds of times slower.

Don't really understand how you third point alludes to a Web OS/Desktop, really is a point that supports the concept of Complimentary online services.

I might install a good processor with an L2 cache far superior to even the best Proxy Cache storing my data hundreds of miles away.

Oh and we all know EyeOS is a waste of time, but i see no reason we should tell them, while they waste their time further degrading society, they won't be writing useful applications to compete with us.

EDIT: I'd also like to add that i have a serious problem with EyeOS an similar applications in General, as well as whoever it was that said we should build different kind's of applications that access the Web. All this ideas are coming from trained monkey's, who know a little HTML and assume they understand the Internet. Every single one of them seems to not realise their is far more to the internet that the Web.

For one thing, all parts of the Web should be accessible to everyone, so to branch out into other applications is stupid. If you need a different protool, use a Different Web Service. Not only will it reduce the amount of Requests Unrelated Servers have to deal with but it won't slow down the new systems with Web related specifications.

With applications like Web Desktops being accessed from Web Browsers, you get the complete opposite problem. They should be accessed from other applications because the Service is so unrelated to the Web, and would be far easier to use and faster if designed around another spcification, especially a system that intergrated the Services into an operating system to make them transparent instead of the excessive bulk that is EyeOS.

[gaf]

From what I can tell there's still some confusion about the ideas brought forward in the the two original posts. This is hardly surprising as they didn't revealed much substantial in the first place and thus left a lot of room for interpretation. There's however one sentence in the second post that struck me as rather interesting as it includes some more concrete information:

The OSI (Operating System Interface) is not any technologically advanced thing, it is simply a way for a user to connect to a web based OS without using Windows, OS X, Linux, etc... The idea of this is to make it so light weight, that it's like it isn't even there

The system described in this passage sounds quite similiar to a project sun was working on some time ago (SLIM). The basic idea is that all processing is delegated to a remote server farm with the local computer being nothing more than a dump terminal. Clients will use a set-top box that send all input (mouse, keyboard) to the server farm where the actual programmes areexecuted and data is stored. The server then sends a screen update to the client that only has to be copied to the framebuffer by the set-top box.

Sun has written a example implementation of this technique and was able to prove that performance as perceived by the user (response time) can be compared to a desktop machine provided that the internet connection is sufficiently fast (todays DSL are sufficient)

Updates can easily be automated and Installations be simplified on current systems. I really don't see what you are saying this one, other than that my data s freely accessible to a remote administrator, i have less control over my system and that just so i don't have to click some "Next" buttons i have to run my software hundreds of times slower

Keep in mind that not everyone enjoys an afternoon of installing linux. A remote OS could provide you a level of comfort that no automated updates or installations could ever reach. You pay a small fee every month and in turn no longer have to worry about the system: The provider buys and installs new hardware, updates system software, installs programmes and keeps a backup of your files to avoid loss of data. The system just works without you having to fix things every few weeks

In my opinion such a service would not only be intersting for the average non-geek users that really just wants to surf the internet and type a few documents, but also for small to medium sized companies that could save a lot of money by outsourcing their computer administration

I might install a good processor with an L2 cache far superior to even the best Proxy Cache storing my data hundreds of miles away.

All programmes and your whole data is stored on the server farm. Downloading a file thus doesn't have to mean that it is also sent to your local machine, instead it is saved on a remote server that belongs to the farm. As all of the provider's servers are interconnected via a high-speed local network internal exchange of data can be very fast. Sending your friend a video only means copying the file to a different server in the same room so that there's no need to send it over a (slow) internet connection. If the server farm has a proxy cache and a sufficiently large user base a lot of internet contents will be available on the local high-speed network

Oh and we all know EyeOS is a waste of time, but i see no reason we should tell them, while they waste their time further degrading society, they won't be writing useful applications to compete with us.

It can't compete with the "hello world" kernels most of us are working on ?

Actually I agree with you that EyeOS is nothing more than a toy at the moment, but at least it's a quite nice looking one that can get even some work done. Think of it as something "realistic" to prove that such projects are quite feasible..

regards,
gaf

[Tyler]

Actually I agree with you that EyeOS is nothing more than a toy at the moment, but at least it's a quite nice looking one that can get even some work done. Think of it as something "realistic" to prove that such projects are quite feasible..

regards,
gaf

Well it's probably just jealousy then, as i was hoping my specifications for Internet Services that do everything mentioned here but transparently and without excess movement of Data onto the web would be implemented long before these bad ideas get too much attention.

Also, My operating system has the ability to run with all features active straight from the LiveCD/LiveDVD while simulaneously installing in the background. It also allows editing of the file system whether it has been written, paritally or not at all.

I don't see why any of these problems can't be sorted without a childish application like a Webtop. I say childish not because it is pathetic, but because the entire idea is the kind of application you make for fun because it gives you a kick when you first experience programming. Much like the KNOME Desktop i wrote my PS2 in YaBasic.

[gaf]

I don't see why any of these problems can't be sorted without a childish application like a Webtop

Sigh..

Maybe I should have used my time to do something more productive than trying to explain you that we're not even talking about a web application. Come back once you've read my entire post and at least skimmed over the paper I provided

regards,
gaf

[blackcatcoder]

@mathematic...

wtf ?

i am new to programming?, that costs me just a little smile

[chuckr30230]

Hey Guys...

Gave up on the project because of the wonderful support you all provided me.

Has everyone seen Google Chrome OS? (Chromium OS)

It's nearly the exact same concept I had attempted to pitch to you 1.5 years ago.

I'll admit, I was a young duck back then, but you all stomped me down and threw my idea out the window. Now there's the "netbook" "revolution" that Google is essentially pioneering. They're building the ultimate lightweight operating system in which everything runs off of the internet.

I was just thinking about past projects and I wondered if I could find this thread anywhere.

Happy Development,
Never take no for an answer,

Chuck D
http://www.43nine.com

[NickJohnson]

Even assuming that is true, it's not like you as a single person, or even a small group of people, could make the progress Google has over these 1.5 years. Not to mention that you don't have their absolutely monstrous number of servers or hordes of followers to support you.

What's worse, it's not like Google is in fact "pioneering the netbook revolution". Their operating system is nothing more than Linux with a new graphics system, and netbooks have been popular for over a year now, more due to the actual manufacturers of the hardware and some endorsing telecommunications companies.

I'm sorry that your idea was thrown out the window. However, you not only did not have to take our advice, but if you did, you have undoubtedly directed your energy in a more fruitful direction than that of the intractable task that you described. So please, don't complain and don't dig up old threads. This is a closure not meant to be invoked.

[Dex]

Hey Guys...

Gave up on the project because of the wonderful support you all provided me.

Has everyone seen Google Chrome OS? (Chromium OS)

It's nearly the exact same concept I had attempted to pitch to you 1.5 years ago.

I'll admit, I was a young duck back then, but you all stomped me down and threw my idea out the window. Now there's the "netbook" "revolution" that Google is essentially pioneering. They're building the ultimate lightweight operating system in which everything runs off of the internet.

I was just thinking about past projects and I wondered if I could find this thread anywhere.

Happy Development,
Never take no for an answer,

Chuck D
http://www.43nine.com

I have also attempted to pitch the browser OS idea before you, with no luck http://forum.osdev.org/viewtopic.php?f= ... ilit=webos

But theres still hope for some of you to see the light, we are most welcoming to new members .

[Combuster]

I put the Troll label on this one, dex. We all know this is only going to yield the exact same arguments.

This is a closure not meant to be invoked.

QFT