China's quake tolls soar with over 12,000 dead!!!

rjying · Post by **rjying** » Wed May 14, 2008 8:32 pm

piranha wrote:Try going to the Tibet entry on Wikipeia.

Because you live in the country that is controlling it, and that country has the control of information, obviously you can only know what you are told. Revolts are happening, and we get this information from the media, yes, but there is real footage and we receive this info from many places. Infact, there are many cries that the U.S. should not attend the Olympics because of this.

China just needs to be OK with itself and stop this whole Tibet business.

-JL

Control of information? We can visit the Internet, We can visit the CNN ,BBC.
We can read the English news. There full of lies. A lot of lies are evidence.
A few of IQ can discern it.
Please donot bias with Chinese Communist. They are getting ahead.
If you think the Tibet need freedom, Please appeal the USA give back the country to Injun.

rjying · Post by **rjying** » Wed May 14, 2008 8:40 pm

Do you think your media are honesty?
Please visit http://www.anti-cnn.com

piranha · Post by **piranha** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:32 pm

rjying wrote: Control of information? We can visit the Internet, We can visit the CNN ,BBC.
We can read the English news. There full of lies. A lot of lies are evidence.
A few of IQ can discern it.
Please donot bias with Chinese Communist. They are getting ahead.
If you think the Tibet need freedom, Please appeal the USA give back the country to Injun.

We see propaganda at work yet again.
We each have our own 'facts'. Each of those 'facts' are supported by 'evidence'. All that 'evidence' comes from different 'sources'. One difference is that you live in one country giving you sets of 'facts' and everyone else is living in many different countries and they give another set of facts. The difference is that all of the second set of facts agree. None of them agree with the first set of facts.
We each can only know what we are told, so everyone thinks that they are right.

P.S. The propaganda is the telling of you that everyone else is full of lies.
Say, 40 people think one thing that is being told to them by several people, but 4000 other people think another thing being told to them by many many sources.
-JL

piranha · Post by **piranha** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:35 pm

anti-cnn.com wrote:The site is maintained by volunteers, who are not associated with any government officials.

Thats........sigh.
The fact that they say that, in my opinion, proves everything we've been saying (they try to say that this isn't propaganda this way, proving that everything is propaganda, because they need to distance themselves from the propaganda givers [the government] to make you believe it).
Do you think that that statement is true? Maybe, maybe not...

Please appeal the USA give back the country to Injun.

Yeah, the difference is that we know what actually happened.

-JL

Solar · Post by **Solar** » Wed May 14, 2008 11:38 pm

@ rjying:

I will freely admit that our media - any media, actually - is always "colored" by the opinions and agendas of those making the news. Looking behind the facade and recognizing what is facade and what is fact is a certain skill.

Propaganda has a very unique "color", which you come to recognize if you are brought up learning to be critical towards what the media feeds you.

I am German, my school time was the eighties (late cold-war). You can trust me when I say that "propaganda" and "critical media reception" were elemental subjects of my schooling. (I won't go into details as Godwin's Law was already invoked in this thread.

)

And what "your media" produced regarding Tibet was 1-A grade propaganda material.

Again, I do not say that what our media reports is the real, unvarnished truth. But what I got from the Chinese media was utter and complete propaganda drivel.

All of which doesn't help the earthquake victims, who have lost homes, friends, family and lives. This thread was about them.

Solar · Post by **Solar** » Wed May 14, 2008 11:42 pm

piranha wrote:
That's why pretty much all Americans can't really go to certain places in the world without an escort.
Pretty much all? I'm American, and I have learned a lot from my parents about how things work. I think that I'd be fine. But I'll stop taking this personally and say that most Americans are idiots (they elected and re-elected) G.W.Bush. However, not all Americans are that dumb nor fall into that stereotype.

No they don't. I talked to - and met - several of your countrymen who were intelligent, reflected, insightful persons.

Unfortunately they are overshadowed by the "stereotypical American"... stereotypes can be very hard to overcome.

JamesM · Post by **JamesM** » Thu May 15, 2008 1:18 am

Solar wrote:
piranha wrote:
That's why pretty much all Americans can't really go to certain places in the world without an escort.
Pretty much all? I'm American, and I have learned a lot from my parents about how things work. I think that I'd be fine. But I'll stop taking this personally and say that most Americans are idiots (they elected and re-elected) G.W.Bush. However, not all Americans are that dumb nor fall into that stereotype.
No they don't. I talked to - and met - several of your countrymen who were intelligent, reflected, insightful persons.

Unfortunately they are overshadowed by the "stereotypical American"... stereotypes can be very hard to overcome.

@Piranha: The quote from me is actually not saying that "pretty much all Americans are too stupid to fit in another culture", because that's not my opinion at all. It's that the US foreign policy has made it pretty difficult for Americans to go abroad (to certain places) without meeting people who want to bash their heads in!

Combuster · Post by **Combuster** » Thu May 15, 2008 1:22 am

JamesM wrote:@Piranha: The quote from me is actually not saying that "pretty much all Americans are too stupid to fit in another culture", because that's not my opinion at all. It's that the US foreign policy has made it pretty difficult for Americans to go abroad (to certain places) without meeting people who want to bash their heads in!

So true. We went to Pakistan with friends (which for the record weren't stereotypical pakistani either). Everybody there can see you're a foreigner, and we've had several occasions when we got the remark "So, you're not american? Then it's O.K."

Zacariaz · Post by **Zacariaz** » Thu May 15, 2008 5:08 am

lollynoob wrote:Edit: Thanks Zacariaz, that was pretty much the point I was getting at.

No thanks required. I wasn't defending you, but your opinion. As I see it, the "So are the inhabitants of Tibet." remark from JamesM is far worse, as it suggests that those who died actually deserved it. I didn't think that this was the message he meant to send and therefor I didn't comment on it.

piranha · Post by **piranha** » Thu May 15, 2008 8:10 am

It's that the US foreign policy has made it pretty difficult for Americans to go abroad (to certain places) without meeting people who want to bash their heads in!

I hate the policy, but then again, I don't know if I meet someone in another country will they say "Are you American? Whats you thoughts on it's current situation?".
I hate it too.

-JL