Arabic Alphapet&ASCIISupport

[CommunistPancake]

because they have more than 3 representation for the one alphabet (like "Be") and secoud problem is the sym of the alphabets for example:

ب

can be read "Be", "Ba", "Bo" and ..., how you want to implement this?!

Couldn't you just output ب and be done with it?

[Love4Boobies]

What is the question? How do we implement what? Unicode?

[psnix]

Couldn't you just output ب and be done with it?

no

"Be" for example:
بر
لبل
ب
لب
are 4 different types of "be"

in persian vowels doesn't write and in the arabic they write under or above of alphabets:

بُ -> Bo
بِ -> Be
بَ -> Ba
....

text mode can't show this, and you must use graphical mode for showing arabic texts. arabic writing is very bad and you have many problems in learning and reading it. worest thing about arabic is one vowel can be change completely mean of the one word. persian (Parsi - arabs says Farsi) doesn't have this problems (vowels and means).

[iocoder]

Arabization and arabic:
Big problem of the persians and turks. It's interesting we try to remove arabic and arabic alphabet from our language. and you want to create an arabic processor.

there are many problems in the representing right to left language (like as arabic and persian) in the computer systems. because they have more than 3 representation for the one alphabet (like "Be") and secoud problem is the sym of the alphabets for example:

ب

can be read "Be", "Ba", "Bo" and ..., how you want to implement this?!

in our country in the pahlavi government, shah (King) start a project for removing arabic words and arabic writing from persian language (like as ataturk in turkey) and many of the arabic words removed from our language (but in coming of the new arab based government I.R.I all try ... pufffffff)

EuroFarsi writing convention:
http://www.eurofarsi.com/

i think it's better than creating a new arabic processor

sorry for my bad english

Hello!
In fact, it is not a problem yet! it might be a problem of pahlavi people, but in general, it is NOT a problem... If you studied linguistics, you would know that this type of writing that links between characters and symbols has a lot of advantages, and exactly implementing it in Computer Science is so easy, here in Egypt, I have Microsoft Windows installed on my computer in Arabic, there is no problem yet in the implementation and the language is 100% correct..

About the letter "Beh", It is so easy to know the way you spell any letter, if just you know the morphological source of the word... it is an issue that exists in all languages, like for example the word "STATUS", beginners of English might spell it like statyous
but people who reached a good stage in study English know well that status is a Latin word that is read like this st-ate-us.

One More Advantage in Arabic is "Tashkeel" which can be put on a letter to know how it is spelled (this doesn't exist in Latin writing), for example the word "مكتبة" means library or a bibliotheca, it is read "Maktaba", someone might read it "Mektaba", but we can but a "Fat-ha" on the "m", this means that it is read "Maktaba" مَكتبة. all people who studied arabic even begginers know that it is on the way of "Maf'aala" like "Maklama" pencil case, "Mastara" ruler and these words..
the morphological source of "Maktaba" is "Kataba" which means the verb "to write".
the morpholofical source of "Maf'aala" is "fa'ala" which means "to do".
the source of "Maklama" is "Kalama" which means "to use the pen to write"
the source of "Mastara" is "Satar" which means "to rule" in english

Just spend 7 days reading some of the great arabic literature and you will find it easy to read, and it is really easy to implement

Regards,
Mostafa Abd El-Aziz

[Solar]

Not trying to put too fine a point to it... I have the greatest respect for the Arabian culture in general. For many centuries, these people somewhat rightfully considered those living in Europe to be barbarians.

There is a lot to be said for Arabian literature, language, and scripture.

(Just like, while we're at it, Chinese and Japanese.)

But as far as "ease of implementation" is concerned, the Latin/UK/US 26-letter alphabet beats everything else hands-down.

Which is somewhat unfortunate, because it led the early computer designers to ignore internationalization problems for decades, thinking that they could "get along" with ASCII-7, leaving us with the befuddled mess of several different codepages and Unicode encodings we are facing today.

Combining encodings, where the glyph of a character changes depending on predecessors or successors, is messy to say the least, and it takes great care not to get caught in the footholes of even a perfectly functional Unicode implementation.

(Check out this lecture by Jon Skeet to learn why replacing all occurences of two spaces in a string with only one space can tight-loop when using Unicode... transscript available here.)

Again: With all due respect, but "ease of implementation" is not on the feature list of arabic script.

[OsDeveloper]

Logic dictates that if your bootloader does not print any text, it supports any and all languages. Arabic included

I could not seem to deliver my words to you well my intention was simple: I can if I did not support amnesty Arab Okhtit felt when off the stage, I know very well that the take-off a few seconds and print No text was also my intention is to the real situation and not take-off and some members prefer to deliver the information to me which I have before me several ways to do about it, such as support ArabIC in VGA stage
I do not know well it may be entangled my question a little bit or I could not ask it delivers a good or even good, but from the perspective of many whom I am the subject very interesting and important in our Arab countries is very important because there are many computer users do not speak English
Thanks for all of the replies by information and advised me and apologized for the misunderstanding that happened because of me


Note:Was my intention of making a new processor is the work of the new architecture of the computer and of course I'm not mad at the present time to do this, and of course highly unlikely this because it simply re-invention of the wheel was my intention, which seems I did not boosted by getting it properly or not connected him to everyone is that if Computer architecture was currently not enable me to do this I had to do this to design a new architecture will not do this, of course, I then I will disarm this idea out of my head I mean this is no more
Best Wishes
Mohamed

[Solar]

Well, in any case you deserve respect for making an effort to express your thoughts in a language (English) that is obviously very difficult for you.

I've seen native speakers making much less of an effort to be understood...

[psnix]

Again: With all due respect, but "ease of implementation" is not on the feature list of arabic script.

i accept this. i doesn't think arabic script have any advantage than latin. there are many and many problems.

at this time persians follow 2 type of writing:

1. fenglish ( خورشید (sun) -> khorshid: reading and writing is like as english)
2. EuroFarsi ( خورشید -> xoršid, contain all alphabets and vowels)

every two script can be used in ASCII and Unicode formats. first format is easy to use and second is very easy in reading and ...). i hope in the future we use this instead of arabic script. at now i document all of the my softwares and ... in EuroFarsi

[iocoder]

Chinese and Japanese.

Sure both are great languages and great civilizations

But as far as "ease of implementation" is concerned, the Latin/UK/US 26-letter alphabet beats everything else hands-down.

Yes, i think so, too!

i accept this. i doesn't think arabic script have any advantage than latin. there are many and many problems.

Hello again!
Please let me tell you that Arabic script has a lot of advantages that doesn't exists in Latin writing [Latin also have advantages that doesn't exist in any script]. About problems: 21 COUNTRIES ARE READING, WRITING, LISTENING, AND SPEAKING ARABIC AND NO-ONE REPORTED A PROBLEM YET
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_world

Best Regards,
Mostafa Abd El-Aziz

[OsDeveloper]

Again: With all due respect, but "ease of implementation" is not on the feature list of arabic script.

i accept this. i doesn't think arabic script have any advantage than latin. there are many and many problems.

at this time persians follow 2 type of writing:

1. fenglish ( خورشید (sun) -> khorshid: reading and writing is like as english)
2. EuroFarsi ( خورشید -> xoršid, contain all alphabets and vowels)

every two script can be used in ASCII and Unicode formats. first format is easy to use and second is very easy in reading and ...). i hope in the future we use this instead of arabic script. at now i document all of the my softwares and ... in EuroFarsi

megan idon't know what's your problem with arabic
the strange thing that I noticed it that you compare arabic Once with latin and And again with
the problem that Solar said it and Iagree with him in that point that the really problem that computer early designers and until now internationalization problems from this kind and most of people who worked in this field Usually pay no attention to these things
for example arabic and farsi and Hebrew has Significant difference with all other languages because writting are from right to left Unlike other languages and I do not disagree with everyone that there are plenty of other problems as well but we need to think in a solution at least for the time being within the limits of what we can do and this is my goal
Regards
MohamedIBrahim

[Solar]

for example arabic and farsi and Hebrew has Significant difference with all other languages because writting are from right to left Unlike other languages...

There are languages that write top-down. (Traditional Chinese, for example.) Then there are languages that write left-to-right in the first line, and then right-to-left in the second... put that in your character processing and smoke it...

Even worse, and I only just now stumbled across it: In Indic Devangari, apparently, Unicode stores the codes in pronounciation order, and the glyph rendering engine is responsible for reordering that into presentation form... holy Mike...

[Owen]

Even worse, and I only just now stumbled across it: In Indic Devangari, apparently, Unicode stores the codes in pronounciation order, and the glyph rendering engine is responsible for reordering that into presentation form... holy Mike...

Unicode always stores text in 'logical order', where logical order is the order in which a native speaker would think. For example, in mixed Arabic-Latin text (Or mixed Arabic text and Arabic numbers!), the Arabic text is coded right-to-left but the latin is coded left-to-right. The BiDi (Bi Directional) algorithm is used in order to reflow the text into visual order for display.

My recommendation to anyone who needs to process Unicode and/or multilingual text is to just use ICU. ICU has all the logic necessary to deal with the various languages of the world - unless your language is really rare and there is no OpenType presentation formatter specified for it yet, in which case you may wish to additionally incorporate SIL Graphite. Graphite stores the formatting data as bytecode in the font to support rare scripts (this is why it exists).

[CommunistPancake]

Couldn't you just output ب and be done with it?

no

"Be" for example:
بر
لبل
ب
لب
are 4 different types of "be"

in persian vowels doesn't write and in the arabic they write under or above of alphabets:

بُ -> Bo
بِ -> Be
بَ -> Ba
....

text mode can't show this, and you must use graphical mode for showing arabic texts. arabic writing is very bad and you have many problems in learning and reading it. worest thing about arabic is one vowel can be change completely mean of the one word. persian (Parsi - arabs says Farsi) doesn't have this problems (vowels and means).

Oh, I thought you meant that ب could be either of those things.

[OSwhatever]

But as far as "ease of implementation" is concerned, the Latin/UK/US 26-letter alphabet beats everything else hands-down.

We can thank Johannes Gutenberg for that. In order to make the manufacturing of the letter type pieces easier it required that the letters were simplified. You can take a hand written text before the book printing took pace and compare it to hand written text after. You can clearly see the difference. I would probably have difficulties reading the text before the age of book printing.

These adjustments of the letters haven't been as obvious in many other languages and you can clearly see that the letters still are optimized for hand writing. Later on high resolution graphics have made it easier for these languages.

[DavidCooper]

In the early stages of booting you might be prepared to consider using "European" numbers in your OS to indicate progress without going against its Arabic identity - European numbers come from Arabic, as you can see if you rotate your monitor 90 degrees to the right.

I'd like to thank the Arabs for getting rid of our old MCMLXXVIII rubbish, and I'd also like to thank the Indians for nothing. I don't think I'd ever have tried to program in machine code without them.