port 60h wonder

jal · Post by **jal** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:42 am

Philip wrote:could not read from port 60h of tc1000, i bought a different computer already, what a waste of money, damn the USB keyboard

Like JAAMan already said, it may be a setting in the BIOS, and you did not respond to any suggestion I made: using Bochs, checking BIOS, etc. In general it is very unwise to buy non-standard hardware for OS development, especially notebooks and such. But again, and I'll write it in bold so you cannot miss it: Use an emulator like Bochs or Qemu for the early stages of OS development. You cannot do without. If you think you can, you are wrong.

JAL

Philip · Post by **Philip** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 12:33 am

i can built my basic input output already, without bochs
i debug by printing values to screen

jal · Post by **jal** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:51 am

Philip wrote:i can built my basic input output already, without bochs
i debug by printing values to screen

That's not the point. Development on real hardware is infinitly slower than that in an emulator. And perhaps you can still debug now by printing values, but that really won't help when tripple faulting or the like.

JAL

JamesM · Post by **JamesM** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:10 am

jal wrote:
Philip wrote:i can built my basic input output already, without bochs
i debug by printing values to screen
That's not the point. Development on real hardware is infinitly slower than that in an emulator. And perhaps you can still debug now by printing values, but that really won't help when tripple faulting or the like.

JAL

I expect, in one or two months time, to see a post under the "General Programming" subforum with the title "Help! I've destroyed my harddrive while testing my ATA driver! Help!".

When it appears, Mr. Smug (me) will appear and laugh at you.

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:07 am

I disagree, i have never used a emulator in my OS Dev cycle, i have done all my Dev work on real PC's, i must turn my main test PC on/off about a 100 times aday (at least ) and i have never had any of my PC's break in anyway.
Maybe had to replace one or two floppy's, disks, not drives.
The only time i use emulators is so others can test.

This is all you need to debug code

Code: Select all

	mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "1"
; Some code
	mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "2"
; Some code
	mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "3"
; Some code
	mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "4"
; Some code
	mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "5"
; Some code

I was surprised when Tomasz Grysztar said thats he user's (the coder of Fasm) only this method and if its good enough for him, it good enough for me.

Ninjarider · Post by **Ninjarider** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:44 pm

once your in protected mode you cant use a usb keyboard without having your own usb drivers. i had a lot of issues with switching to p because my keyboard wouldn't respond and that was with legacy enabled.

jal · Post by **jal** » Wed Mar 26, 2008 2:08 am

Dex wrote:I disagree, i have never used a emulator in my OS Dev cycle, i have done all my Dev work on real PC's, i must turn my main test PC on/off about a 100 times aday (at least ) and i have never had any of my PC's break in anyway.

It's not just about breaking, it's that transferring your OS to a floppy, move the floppy to the test machine, reboot the test machine, wait until the OS boots, etc. etc. takes a pretty long time. So unless you're truely multi tasking and can do something else in the meanwhile, you are wasting time. Emulators are far faster, and there's not the physical floppy moving etc. you need. I'm not critiquing you're preferred method of OS development (you seem to have done pretty well this way), but in general it's not a wise thing to do this.

This is all you need to debug code
Code:

Code: Select all

mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "1"
; Some code
   mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "2"
; Some code
   mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "3"
; Some code
   mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "4"
; Some code
   mov   byte [fs:0xB809E], "5"
; Some code

That won't help you when tripple faulting and/or when using paging, unless you manage to reboot into some special monitor that can still analyze that address (provided it knows the physical address in case of paging).

I think that most here agree that for a newbee, using an emulator like Bochs is the wisest thing to do. Noone says one cannot do without, just that it is very cumbersome and (even more) time consuming.

JAL

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Wed Mar 26, 2008 6:31 am

Yes your right jal, emulator's do have there placers, and are a big help to many newbee and life would be much harder without them, from a OS dev point of view.

But i was just disagreeing with this point

Use an emulator like Bochs or Qemu for the early stages of OS development. You cannot do without. If you think you can, you are wrong

I would say
Use an emulator like Bochs or Qemu for the early stages of OS development. Or you will end up doing a lot more work.

jal · Post by **jal** » Wed Mar 26, 2008 10:28 am

Dex wrote:I would say
Use an emulator like Bochs or Qemu for the early stages of OS development. Or you will end up doing more work.

Ok, if you change "more work" with "a lot more work (unless you're a damn good programmer)" I can agree with that :).

JAL

Dex · Post by **Dex** » Wed Mar 26, 2008 12:26 pm

Done